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Naa, what Rodger is talking about is: "My sole purpose for posting on forums is to share evidence that the Bible, literally translated, does not teach that God will let anyone suffer forever. All other issues are infinitely secondary to me, so that is why I ignore responding to them".

Evil is unreal? A dream? Philosophy has some wild ideas of which make no sense. I'd say the non-dual philosophy whereof nothing is real is one of those nonsensical ideas.

Reading any newspaper (or even looking at our own personal lives) will convince most of us that evil and suffering are very real no matter how we might analize them.
I'm glad I can believe in a God who will eventually transform all evil and suffering into something better for everyone that it temporarily existed, and by so doing, God will justify to everyone's satisfaction the temporary existence of evil and suffering that everyone experiences in varying degrees.

How is evil judged? What is the greater sin[offense]? The ancient Jewish thinkers tried to analyse "evil" compared to "good". Their laws compartmentalized in defining what was evil to the Jews: idolatry practiced by other people in worship of many gods, certain foods were named as offensive for Jews, certain animals could not be used in sacrifices to their Hebrew god. Evil had its degrees of offensiveness for the Jews.

What did other people judge as offensive among themselves in their groups? For example, did the Egyptians think it evil to sacrifice animals and use animal blood as a protective covering? Did the Egyptians celebrate yearly their god "RA" killing any firstborn of any other people? Did the Egyptians think the Jewish god Yahweh was an evil and corrupt god? Or had the Egyptians never heard the story Jews had set against them? Is the Jewish tale offensive to the Egyptians today?

For me the important issue is that according to the Bible, no matter how evil is judged, the offender will receive kolasis aionion which means age-during corrective chastisement, not inescapable eternal torment.

http://www.tentmaker.org/books/asw/Chapter11.html

The old testament says nothing about eternal torment in a fire burning hell, lake of fire. Nor does it say anything about a heaven up in the sky via an afterlife. What it does say, is that instruction for the Jews so as to prolong their life on earth, they should control their behavior and develop their mind toward peace among themselves. A behaviorial modification presented in their laws given by Moses that was to ensure civil order amongst them. Bad behavior, of course, had its consequences reflected in the death penalty. The death penalty in its punishment for the sin also blotted out that particular name from Israel. This would have had affect on entire families, as widows and children of the accused criminal would suffer in some form without the husband and his connection to his particular tribal connection.

As time went on, these laws were "interpreted" by different leading rabbi's[the head] to fit each existing generation. Laws sometimes became lax and sin increased. Also, false interpretations began to emerge, things accounted to the wicked priests. One such false interpretation is mentioned in Ezekiel whereof the Lord chastizes that interpretive evil as in purposed to deceive his people. Here you see men, false teachers, teaching for doctrine the commandments of men. How were the wicked priests doing this and what were they telling the people?

Seems the wicked priests then were desiring fame and glory be paid to themselves not only in honor as heads of the congregation, but payment in the form of gifts. The comparison can be seen in how TV evangelical preachers deceive people in their end-time predictions. The wicked priests created evil and set about teaching the people of Israel that their souls could "fly". This is the forerunning false teaching of an afterlife that had developed into a glorified heavenly belief in the NT. Where there was had been none and nothing at the beginning with Moses and the laws, one and something was invented and reinvented. To counter-side this, hell was invented to put fear and terror into the minds of people with the control factor being most prominent. At this time in the NT period, laws of Moses were not as strictly kept and the death penalty was frowned upon by Jews. So the invention of methods of punishment began to appear. The hell Jesus portrayed is one such frightening method of the imagination. And such teaching was probably already livid before Jesus came on the scene. The elders, Pharisees and Sadducees may have taught the same hell as Jesus. Inventiveness to control the behavior of people. Inventiveness to persuade the people to believe the priests. And there was competition among the priests as to what people should believe as seen in what they taught. The Pharisees and Sadducees taught differently, as did Jesus. Who were the people supposed to believe? Who would you believe?

Priests then, and preachers now today, survive in their wicked and evil teachings built on their own lies. They simply cannot survive on truth, because truth puts them in a position of not being needed as a "scholar" with pretense of divine knowledge claiming God has spoken to them or talked to them or has inspired them through a "spiritual" encounter. The average person who reads, studies, does research, etc. is a definite threat to the lifestyle of the scholar, preacher, priest and rabbi,.. And of course, their love of money (in OT called 'gifts') is the root of their evildoing. One might say that creating and sustaining lies was and is their prioritized business. The evil and wicked priests first began to receive the best of the sacrifices. Having learned to play the system of "the elect" as "gods chosen people who should speak for Him, the priests continued to expand their role as the head, while the false prophets would bring themselves into position as the tail.

So you're correct Rogertutt, no hell for everlasting torment. And no heaven, afterlife, no so-called "spirits". No demons, no ghosts, and what's left is the best thing of all, Reality in the here and now. We can reflect on the past, however there is no "future" as in a tomorrow, for tomorrow(s) never comes.

Be happy.

To Roselyn regarding "the best thing of all."

Jesus said He has gone to prepare a place for us where there will be no more death or sorrow or crying or pain. For me, that is "the best thing of all."

I share the same point of view as Dr. Leslie Weatherhead who said
“God’s purposes are so vast and glorious, beyond all guessing now, that when they are achieved and consummated, all our sufferings and sorrows of today, even the agonies that nearly break our faith, the disasters that well nigh overwhelm us, shall, seen from that fair country where God’s age long dreams come true, bulk as little as bulk now the pieces of a broken toy upon a nursery floor, over which, thinking that all our little world was in ruins, we cried ourselves to sleep.”

My "reality in the here and now" comes from my joy in being able to believe that.

"Jesus, Whom having not seen you love. Though now you see Him not, yet believing you rejoice with joy unspeakable and full of glory." 1Peter 1:8

I don't fear death Rogertutt. I don't look forward to a mythical heaven or a punishment in a damnable hell. I don't look for a hero Jesus to rescue me from my own behavior or slaughter innocent people due to their not believing in the bible story.

If you believe in Jesus I can tolerate your misguided belief. If you're willing to kill innocent people who are not Jews or Christians, then I cannot tolerate your death cult and will try in every way to show how your religion is nothing more than a mythical load of pure bullshit.

I am glad that I can have the perception that God will eventually not ony justify, but actually transform all evil and suffering into something better that it happened for everyone no matter how horrendous the past has been for anyone.

From the Christian point of view here is why I believe that.
http://www.tentmaker.org/articles/savio ... tution.htm
(see especially the very last paragraph on that link)